Friday, September 17, 2021
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We Got What We Were After, And Now It’s Time To Go

It was often said, in the early shadows of 9/11, that America had lost her innocence that day. I understand the point, but I suggest it’s a bit imprecise; America lost a great deal that day, to be sure, but innocence? I don’t think so. Our Country is no stranger to heartache and bloodshed.

In the run up to Bush’s election in 2000, there was no small amount of talk about becoming a bit more isolationist. Bush would have been the first to admit he’d have rather STOPPED fighting bad guys on foreign soil (think Clinton and Yugoslavia et. al.). In fact, he talked quite a bit in the early days of his new Presidency about spending American treasure on the economy that magically tanked after election day (internet bubble) and looking inward to address the Nation’s ills. That all went away the following September.

So, we went to Afghanistan and turned the place upside down – ran off the Government that aided and abetted the deaths of thousands of innocents who had previously had no bone to pick with Osama Bin Laden or his personal vendetta against the infidel – and set up shop trying to get some normal people in positions of power in order that no more terrorism breeding would occur. Mission accomplished? Sorta.

Then, we went after a bad guy in an entirely different place because we believed (rightly or wrongly is long past relevant) he was also breeding terrorism and committing mass murder against his own people. We turned THAT place upside down too, and now… for better or worse… there are “normal” people in positions of power there in order that there be no more breeding of terrorism. Mission accomplished? Sorta.

But, in light of the death of Bin Laden (allegedly), it seems to me at least that we have now gotten what we were after…the man’s head[sic] on a platter. And since we have what we came for, don’t we all think it’s time to pack up now, come back home, and get back to what Bush was trying to suggest 10 years ago? I think so.

So does the Muslim Brotherhood…and I completely agree with their assessment:

“With Bin Laden’s death, one of the reasons for which violence has been practiced in the world has been removed,” Essam al-Erian, a member of the Muslim Brotherhood’s governing body, told Reuters.
“It is time for Obama to pull out of Afghanistan and Iraq and end the occupation of U.S. and Western forces around the world that have for so long harmed Muslim countries,” he said.
[snip]
“The revolutions taking place across the Middle East are proof that democracy has a home in the Middle East and we do not need foreign occupation any more,” Erian said.

Yep – I agree.

We’ve lost a lot of lives and spent a ton of money. And, while we HAVE – for good or ill – gotten the guy that picked this fight, it would appear there are no more points left to make or to prove. We’re done. Let’s pack up our Soldiers and their equipment and what’s left of our treasure over there in Afghanistan and Iraq, and head home. Let’s do it before Obama’s continued mismanagement of these two wars (and the new one he started for FAR less worthy reasons than the two Bush started) kills any more poorly-led and terribly under-appreciated Men and Women.

Bring. Them. Home. Now.

haystackhttp://unwashedphilosopher@gmail.com
There's not much to say... I come from a long line of Appalachian folk that landed in America long before flipping off the King was even a twinkle in the eyes of our founding fathers. We have been Carpenters and coal miners... Soldiers & Sailors and pig farmers and Sunday morning circuit-riding preachers. Hell, I'm told we have even been fairly decent bootleggers too.

10 COMMENTS

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10 COMMENTS

  1. I do part ways with the Muslim Brotherhood about our ally Israel. Keeping an aircraft carrier in the vicinity might give pause to those who want to wipe Israel off the face of the earth.
    Afghanistan is what India and Pakistan have big concerns about. Syria, Iraq, and Bahrain are what Iran and Saudi Arabia have got concerns about. We do not need more American soldiers killed for the sake of those nations. We should support our ally Israel.

    • Yup.

      And I agree inre: Israel, but as to them doing their own version of Democracy? I don’t give a rip what version of it they choose so long as our guys aren’t there to be in the line of fire.

      The billions we spend now, overseas, could be put to a whole lot more practical use right here at home IMHO.

  2. If the truth were known, I agreed with 80% of everything Bill Clinton ever said. But I knew the SOB was lying. It was in his nature to do that.

    The lineage and purposes of the Muslim Brotherhood are no different. If you like their words, fine, just don’t expect them to actually mean it, which is why they’ve made common cause with the American Left, American Labor, and the Democrat Party.

    The war we’re fighting here has long since gone global, They, and I mean all of them, are already here. There isn’t even a way now achieve a hunker-down-and-let-the-rest-of-the world-stew-in-its-own-juice position. being the last one the alligator eats last isn’t my cup of tea.

    But I’m not in favor of a pax americana, either. But neither can i accept handing 3/4 of the world over to tyranny while we hunker down. (No greater love…) i’m for squaring off and ending the world of “that kind” of misery-monger now.

    that said, about afghanistan, yeah. bring ’em home

    • Here’s what we know about Muslims that “negotiate” with their enemies: they lie.

      Whether the MB “means” what what it says or not, we all know their idea of governance is oppression, torture, and death to any who might resist their laws and their ideology. My point here is that, at face value, the words “we’ve got this Democracy thing under control and we don’t need help from the infidels to institute it” works fine for me if the alternative is to keep seeing our own guys getting killed for their (MB’s) entertainment and propaganda machine. We can achieve no global victory against terrorism in Iraq and Afghanistan unless we turn those places into sheets of glass. Since, at best, our current CiC is a sympathizer…and at worst an outright facilitator of… the Radical Muslim hostile takeover of all (approaching all, at least) the Middle East Governments that had any modicum of stability… I say, let them have at it. We can “hunker down” here, stateside, until we replace this POS with someone who understands warfighting and has the word WIN in their vocabulary. When we find such a person, we’ll be able to teach them how to make glass quickly enough.

      I want that St. George person to run out of stuff to write about.

      • Understood, and to the extent we’re not in a current position to sally forth, agreed. Re; Afghanistan, we can bring them home, but we will go back. For the poppy fields if nothing else.

          • You guys are hilarious, but I love you for it. Just to keep this from becoming what VB refers to as the “Algonguin” club, I’ll throw in my two cents worth.

            If you say a word about “protectionism”, it’s on, buddy.

            There’s a lot to be said for wanting to help other people, but when your own house is falling down around you, and your heat isn’t working right, and the weeds are creeping in around the baseboard, there are cracks in the roof, etc., etc….hey, it’s time to get your own house in order.

            I think that’s where we are right now. We need to invest some time in getting our own nation in order.

            Bring our folks home. We need them here.

  3. How about a half-way point? Not so much hunker down mentality but neither keeping our men and women in harm’s way?

    I’d go the route of bringing them home and withdrawing aid but that doesn’t necessarily mean hunkering down. We have the capability of not having to set foot in another country unless it’s necessary. We have ships capable of equaling a military base in size and capacity.

    Withdrawing the billions of dollars of support into countries that hate us is not my cup of tea, either. We’ve been doing it for decades and keep justifying it as building allies when it does no such thing except in lip service. It’s like the old saying, “having their cake and eating it, too.”

    If they want to hate us, we can’t stop them, but I’m really tired of “buying friends”. It does not work in one’s personal life. Why in the world would anyone think it works in politics which is more messed up than any one individual’s life will ever be?

    We no longer have the luxury of sound good, feel good policies.

  1. I do part ways with the Muslim Brotherhood about our ally Israel. Keeping an aircraft carrier in the vicinity might give pause to those who want to wipe Israel off the face of the earth.
    Afghanistan is what India and Pakistan have big concerns about. Syria, Iraq, and Bahrain are what Iran and Saudi Arabia have got concerns about. We do not need more American soldiers killed for the sake of those nations. We should support our ally Israel.

    • Yup.

      And I agree inre: Israel, but as to them doing their own version of Democracy? I don’t give a rip what version of it they choose so long as our guys aren’t there to be in the line of fire.

      The billions we spend now, overseas, could be put to a whole lot more practical use right here at home IMHO.

  2. If the truth were known, I agreed with 80% of everything Bill Clinton ever said. But I knew the SOB was lying. It was in his nature to do that.

    The lineage and purposes of the Muslim Brotherhood are no different. If you like their words, fine, just don’t expect them to actually mean it, which is why they’ve made common cause with the American Left, American Labor, and the Democrat Party.

    The war we’re fighting here has long since gone global, They, and I mean all of them, are already here. There isn’t even a way now achieve a hunker-down-and-let-the-rest-of-the world-stew-in-its-own-juice position. being the last one the alligator eats last isn’t my cup of tea.

    But I’m not in favor of a pax americana, either. But neither can i accept handing 3/4 of the world over to tyranny while we hunker down. (No greater love…) i’m for squaring off and ending the world of “that kind” of misery-monger now.

    that said, about afghanistan, yeah. bring ’em home

    • Here’s what we know about Muslims that “negotiate” with their enemies: they lie.

      Whether the MB “means” what what it says or not, we all know their idea of governance is oppression, torture, and death to any who might resist their laws and their ideology. My point here is that, at face value, the words “we’ve got this Democracy thing under control and we don’t need help from the infidels to institute it” works fine for me if the alternative is to keep seeing our own guys getting killed for their (MB’s) entertainment and propaganda machine. We can achieve no global victory against terrorism in Iraq and Afghanistan unless we turn those places into sheets of glass. Since, at best, our current CiC is a sympathizer…and at worst an outright facilitator of… the Radical Muslim hostile takeover of all (approaching all, at least) the Middle East Governments that had any modicum of stability… I say, let them have at it. We can “hunker down” here, stateside, until we replace this POS with someone who understands warfighting and has the word WIN in their vocabulary. When we find such a person, we’ll be able to teach them how to make glass quickly enough.

      I want that St. George person to run out of stuff to write about.

      • Understood, and to the extent we’re not in a current position to sally forth, agreed. Re; Afghanistan, we can bring them home, but we will go back. For the poppy fields if nothing else.

          • You guys are hilarious, but I love you for it. Just to keep this from becoming what VB refers to as the “Algonguin” club, I’ll throw in my two cents worth.

            If you say a word about “protectionism”, it’s on, buddy.

            There’s a lot to be said for wanting to help other people, but when your own house is falling down around you, and your heat isn’t working right, and the weeds are creeping in around the baseboard, there are cracks in the roof, etc., etc….hey, it’s time to get your own house in order.

            I think that’s where we are right now. We need to invest some time in getting our own nation in order.

            Bring our folks home. We need them here.

  3. How about a half-way point? Not so much hunker down mentality but neither keeping our men and women in harm’s way?

    I’d go the route of bringing them home and withdrawing aid but that doesn’t necessarily mean hunkering down. We have the capability of not having to set foot in another country unless it’s necessary. We have ships capable of equaling a military base in size and capacity.

    Withdrawing the billions of dollars of support into countries that hate us is not my cup of tea, either. We’ve been doing it for decades and keep justifying it as building allies when it does no such thing except in lip service. It’s like the old saying, “having their cake and eating it, too.”

    If they want to hate us, we can’t stop them, but I’m really tired of “buying friends”. It does not work in one’s personal life. Why in the world would anyone think it works in politics which is more messed up than any one individual’s life will ever be?

    We no longer have the luxury of sound good, feel good policies.

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